wbtcpip

april 2018: new requirements for permit extension?

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A friend of mine (he lives in Turkey from 5 years) has normally completed is permit extension and sent all required documents by post. 5 days later he received this message:

BASVURUNUZLA ILGILI SON 6 AYA YONELIK GELIR DURUMUNU GOSTERIR BELGEYI VE IMZA SIRKULERINI, YERLESIM YERI BELGESINI, TURKIYE MAKAMLARINCA TANZIM EDILMIS ADLI SICIL BELGESINI, KENDI ULKE MAKAMLARINCA TANZIM EDILMIS ONAYLI ADLI SICIL BELGESINI, TURKIYE'DE KALIS AMACINI ACIKLAYAN BILGI VE BELGEYI, KAMU SAGLIGINI TEHDIT EDEN HASTALIGI OLMADIGINA DAIR HEYET RAPORUNU 30 GUN ICERISINDE BAKIRKOY IKAMET BASKANLIGIMIZA ELDEN TESLIM ETMENIZ GEREKMEKTEDIR. POSTA YOLUYLA GONDERILEN EKSIK EVRAKLAR KABUL EDILMEYECEKTIR

So, it must produce a long list of documents and take it to the new office in Istanbul Bakirkoy. They never asked for all these documents before. Anyone else has been required for this? Is this the new procedure for everyone or is this a specific case?

 

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Yes unfortunately, the requirements have been tightened. We took the letter that we had been issued from the Nufus with us to the interview but it was rejected because it was more than 2 years old, even though we had the original Tapus with us. To be fair they bent over backwards to help us but they had to have all the docs in place first. they did not really look too hard at the financial docs but they would not accept our printouts from online. They wanted them stamped and signed by the bank. I hope that this helps. Geçmiş Olsun

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Guess I have this to look forward to in 3 years.

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This has just reminded me of why I no longer have a Residency Permit and prefer to have an E-Visa as we now have 3 months in Turkey, 3 months in UK, 3 months in Turkey and 3 months in the UK.

This is what happened to me ... I held a Residency Permit for 10 years, so I went to the government building to ask for a Forever RP which you get virtually for free after the 10 years is up.  They looked on their computer and said NO!  I asked ... Why not? ... and was told that I had been out of the country TWO DAYS TOO MUCH IN 10 YEARS!!!!!   I cannot tell you what words I used but they were not nice.  Why could they not overlook the 2 days in 10 years of a Residency Permit?  I vowed there and then ... Never again! ... and so it was.  

My partner Mike also had a Residency Permit - not for 10 years as I did but that is not the point of this happening ... we flew from Gatwick to Antalya together, both holding RPs as well as E-Visas ... just in case ... our dates of RP were different.  Apparently I was OK because my RP was expiring shortly after we landed at Antalya and then the E-Visa would kick in.  Mike's was another story altogether.  He was told that as he came into Turkey on an RP that is valid, he must go out of Turkey on that same RP and could not use his E-Visa that he held in his hand as the extension.  Therefore, he was told that after only being in Turkey for one week this time, he must go out FOR ONE DAY AT LEAST !!!  And so he did.  He had the expense and the annoyance of having to fly to the UK for 1 day or more.  He went for 4 days not 1, just because the flight costs were better then.  Totally unnecessary and another of the Turkish Government's bits of nonsense.

Hence, neither of us ever wants an RP again.  We have a house in Cardiff in any case and the 3 months in each country back and forth throughout the year suits us both well.  But if we did not own a property back home, what would we do?  Words fail me ...   

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The problem is Angela that you cannot buy or sell a car without the residency, and it is needed for various other things too. Mike did not need to return to the UK, a visit to a Greek island would have done.

In my case I also experienced a problem. My wife and I held 5 year residences and prepared to renew them in good time. We had the Biometric photos taken and i logged into the Goc idaresi site one month before they expired ie 30/03/2018. The site accepted my wife's application but could not 'find' mine. So we drove the 50km to the goc idaresi office to be told that although my residence permit stated that it expired on April 30th, their system had it as expiring 30/03/2018, the day before. So i had to apply as a first time applicant. Problem was that when I went to the 'Nufus' office to prove that my tapu was valid the system would not recognise my TC number as my residence had expired. catch 22. All sorted now. Inshallah

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We choose not to have a car in Turkey ... I drove here once ... never again!  The drivers around here are completely mad.  They don't stop at red lights ever... a few weeks ago I saw a Turkish guy, middle-aged in a big 4 x 4 going around the big roundabout backwards!  So, no driving for us two in Turkey thank you very much...

Yes we know that Mike could have gone to a Greek island instead of the UK but he had a free place to stay at a friend's house near Gatwick and wanted to buy some English food to take back ... so the trip was not for nothing really, although of course he would have preferred just to have stayed in Side, if they would have allowed it ...

I am going to Adrasan in the morning for 6 days with my Turkish dentist, Halile.  The hotel we will stay in is called Paradise and only has 4 bedrooms, so with both of us staying, we take up 50% occupancy!  It looks like a lovely place and is £30 per night each bed and breakfast ... see here ... https://www.google.com.tr/search?q=photos+of+paradise+hotel+in+adrasan+turkey&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiCyLng4sXaAhVBDywKHcsYC7sQ7AkISg&biw=1231&bih=677

Love from Angela x

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Hi

I have just caught up with this news - in summary it seems that in Istanbul only (that's me) any renewal of a Tourist Ikamet will be rejected and unless you are married to a Turk, have a work permit or own a property you will have to leave. It seems the main motivation is to crack down on illegal working - fair enough. But I live without working. I am supported by rental income from a UK property + savings in the UK. There doesn't seem to be any ongoing way of staying in Istanbul now for people like me.

http://residencepermitturkey.com/new-rules-2018-about-ikamet-turkish-residence-permit/

Does anybody have any reports of what is actually happening on the ground in Istanbul? 

Graham

 

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This site is a from a company that helps with Ikamet Applications - I have not been able to verify anything about the restrictions for Istanbul from anywhere else yet so maybe it's not true.

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They don't provide any source for that information. The only reliable source for information is the Göç İdaresi Genel Müdürlüğü (Directorate General of Migration Management, or DGMM). It seems to me the only way to verify anything, or get a true handle on the current procedures, is to call their helpline at 157. When I was writing Turkey Central's guides for residence permits, I frequently interacted with one of the directors of the DGMM in Antalya. He said that these residence permit assistance companies are not authorized by the government. He asked me to get the word out that the DGMM itself goes out of its way to provide assistance for anyone needing a residence permit, both at their offices and through their help line, and that people should only trust, and consult, the DGMM about such matters.

It makes no sense to me why Turkey would want to kick out every foreign retiree who is not married to a Turkish woman. And that would include me! :o

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10 hours ago, GrahamN said:

Does anybody have any reports of what is actually happening on the ground in Istanbul?

on the ground a friend of mine received the message that you see in the first post and it's really hard to produce all that.

I called 157 for infos and they know nothing or they do not want to comment anything ...it's a shame ... 157 is useless

Me i have an appointement for extension of my permit on 16 July 2018 (i cnanot send through ptt because my passport has been renewed).

I'm thinking to quit, or to move into another city of Turkey or to buy a property ... i'll see

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It seems like fake news to me. Why would a foreigner who can show overseas income be interested in working for the kind of wages available here. Fortunately many of us are in a position not to consider working for the minimum wage, but only because we have put in many hard shifts in the past.

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The link I pasted has moved to here now

http://residencepermitturkey.com/new-rules-and-turkish-residence-permit-benefits-2018/

Another site that monitors worldwide change in immigration procedures has something similar

https://www.fragomen.com/insights/alerts/restricted-rules-short-term-residence-permit-applications

It doesn't look like it is just a cut and paste one from the other. It talks though about residence permit renewals only being allowed for an extra 5 months after the initial period. The rest of it seems to be to with getting a police record from your home country and proving from past bank statements that you have been receiving a regular income and don't just have a $6000 lump sum at one point in time

 

 

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Also from the initial post on this subject   TURKIYE'DE KALIS AMACINI ACIKLAYAN BILGI VE BELGEYI  - if you've been a "tourist" here for 5 years what sort of document are they expecting to explain you stay in Turkey?

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39 minutes ago, GrahamN said:

Also from the initial post on this subject   TURKIYE'DE KALIS AMACINI ACIKLAYAN BILGI VE BELGEYI  - if you've been a "tourist" here for 5 years what sort of document are they expecting to explain you stay in Turkey?

You must write that you are looking for a property to purchase, or you are going to get married, or that you're going to work in Turkey. So, maybe, they will give you a short turistic residence permit for the last time.

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27 minutes ago, wbtcpip said:

You must write that you are looking for a property to purchase, or you are going to get married, or that you're going to work in Turkey. So, maybe, they will give you a short turistic residence permit for the last time.

So in fact if that is what they have been told,  then that ties in with what is being reported - you either buy a house, marry a Turk or get a job with a work permit if you want a renewal

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I hope it doesn't turn out that way in the end. If I hear something official I'll verify it locally. Then contact the my embassy. If this is what is intended, I think it is something they haven't really thought through yet.

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Quote

– foreigners who can certify their income from abroad for the last 6 months and the reason of staying in Turkey

That part is a relief, and it makes sense. But just in case, I'm going to apply for a long-term residence permit now. I don't own property, nor do I meet the criteria in the previous version. Thanks for posting this Graham, it is a big "heads up" for us all.

 

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This looks like an attempt to scare people out of Istanbul. Rather than say "No Tourist RPs anymore" - instead - basically you can stay if can jump over 10 hurdles (for a renewal) or 15 (for a 1st time application). Knock one of them over and you'll have to leave. The authorties' hope is that people will give up before they try. 

Again this is for Istanbul - I wonder if they are just picking on a few people to make life difficult. I've heard of random people being asked for police records a few years ago.

 

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It would be nice if someone from other cities of Turkey can tell us if things are changed or as usually out of Istanbul

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After thinking about this for a while, it makes complete sense, and I have already experienced this in Antalya.

I've been living in Turkey for some 15 years. I have never bought a property -- I have always rent. I'm not married to a Turk. I'm retired, so I don't work in Turkey. 

I had my last short-term residence permit appointment in March 2018 at the Antalya DGMM.

The immigration specialist asked me to explain why I am living in Turkey, and why I want to live in Turkey for another year. And I told him. He was satisfied with my reason. They have asked me this question at every interview I have had, going back to my first residence permit interview some 15 years ago.

If somebody owns property, is married to a Turk, works legally in Turkey, etc., they have an obvious reason for being in Turkey. For those who don't, it makes sense that they would ask "why do you want to live in Turkey?"

And if you were a computer system designer, and had to create a drop-down menu of choices for why you were in Turkey, in what way would you categorize someone like me?

Perhaps "Just likes it here?"

So they call the reason people like me live in Turkey "Tourism," even though it sounds like I'm on a never-ending sightseeing trip.

With all of the immigration Turkey is experiencing these days, and no doubt, abuse of the residence permit system, it makes sense they would double-down on screening people.

So if you are here for a good reason (and we all likely are), there should be no problem, other than the insistence on apostilled documents, if they even ask for them.

Regarding apostilled documents, In my last two interviews, they wanted documentation to show my income. Last year, the immigration specialist just asked me to go home, go to my bank's website, and print off my bank statement going back three months. I did so, came back at the end of the day, went to his desk and handed it to him. That was that.

In my last interview (in March 2018), I printed this out in advance of my interview and gave it to the immigration specialist during the interview. He accepted it.

For proof of address, I just went to the local Citizenship and Population Directorate (Nüfus) and got the required address registration document. Just in case, I also went to the local Noter where I previously had a notarized copy of my apartment contract made. I just gave them the Noter's document number for that document. They gave me another notarized copy just based off the number they had stamped on the previously notarized document. I don't even know if that was necessary, but I gave that to the immigration specialist as well.

I feel badly for anyone living in Istanbul if they are going to insist on all of the things on the list in the previous post. But at least up until March of this year, it is not like that, at least it wasn't for me, in Antalya. I received my residence permit card in the mail around 30 days later.

I'm going to try to get an unlimited work permit this year. I don't know of anyone else who has gotten one of these. We'll see what happens.

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In our case (also March 2018) they would not accept a bank statement printed out at home, they wanted a document printed stamped and signed by the bank. No problem in a small town but better if you know to get it in advance.

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