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  1. For short trips to and from nearby cities and towns, or for excursions to local attractions, you can catch a smaller, no-frills bus which usually hold around 15 passengers. These buses either depart from the main bus station, and/or from a smaller satellite bus station on the side of town nearest the destination. These bus routes are run by local companies or cooperatives, and the buses usually depart from around 6:00 AM to midnight on an hourly basis or less. The smaller companies seldom, if ever, have a website where you can book online. To book a seat, you will need to call or go to the bus company office which will be at the local bus station, or at a booth at their main stop in the city or town.You can also just show up, pay the fare, and hop on. They don't usually fill to capacity except during peak hours or on Turkish holidays. But if the next bus is full, you'll be able to get on the one departing after that. If you're going to a place along the way to their destination, let them know, since you might be charged less. While the drivers of these buses don't seek out passengers along the way like a dolmuş, they will stop and pick you up if you flag them down. See Also Turkish for Bus Travel: A guide to Turkish terms you'll need to know while using Turkey's inter-city bus system. Long-distance Bus Travel: A guide for travel by inter-city motor coach. The Dolmuş: A guide to riding privately-owned mini-buses, or jitneys.
  2. Turkish long-distance buses are modern, comfortable, and air-conditioned. Some buses (called teknobus), even have wireless internet and entertainment systems so you can watch a small selection of Turkish television shows and movies on a screen mounted on the back of the seat in front of you (earphones provided). A steward will also serve you snacks, tea, coffee and soft drinks. There are no toilets, and smoking is not allowed. But the trips allow for a ten-minute break, called a mola, approximately every 40 minutes, with longer breaks for meals at designated rest stops along the way. The food at these rest stops is usually excellent. Trips lasting ten hours or more are usually done at night, or twice per day. These long trips can really wear you out. By flying, you can get the trip over with more quickly and not be as tired on arrival as you would after a long bus journey. Flights within Turkey are also reasonably priced, so unless you don't mind sleeping in a bus seat, at least check the airline ticket price and consider it as an option. Another option is to break up the bus trip into two parts, see another city on the way, and get a good night's sleep in between. If there is train service to your destination, you can also get a couchette, or sleeping compartment, on a train where you can get a night's sleep and arrive well-rested the next day. How to Use Buses and Car Rentals Renting a car and driving long distances is expensive, since petrol prices in Turkey are some of the highest in the world. A better option is to take a long-distance bus to your destination, then rent a car there. Once you've seen the local sights, you can take the bus back to your city of origin or to the next city you want to visit. How to Buy a Bus Ticket in Turkey At the Bus Station If you are going from one major city to another, you can usually just go to the bus station, buy a ticket, and wait for the next bus. When you enter the bus station, a tout will usually approach you to see where you're going and take you to his company's ticket desk. You can go with him, or walk along the rows of ticket desks looking for your preferred company or destination. Each company will have signs displaying the destinations they service. The ticket clerks will usually speak enough English to help you with any questions. At a Bus Company Office You can also visit a bus company office in city center and buy a ticket, then take a courtesy bus to the bus station. Ask the clerk when the courtesy bus will be departing, since the time on your ticket refers to the departure time of the bus from the bus station, not the departure of the courtesy bus from the bus company office. The departure time (saat or haraket saati), and the departure gate will be written on your ticket. The major companies will also have a courtesy bus at the bus station at your destination, that will take you to their office downtown. Ask about this when you book your ticket, then again when you arrive, since you will need to find out where to go to connect with the courtesy bus. At Your Hotel You can also have the hotel clerk book your bus ticket for you. Have them call and reserve a seat, then just go to the bus company office and get your ticket. Seating If you want a window seat, ask for a pencere koltuğu (pen-jeh-reh kol-too-oo). For an aisle seat, ask for a koridor koltuğu. (kor-ee-dor kol-too-oo). You can also ask to see the seating plan and point to the seat you want. The most comfortable seats are those in the middle of the bus. Bus Ticket Prices Bus ticket prices vary according to company and the type of bus used. There are discounts for round-trip tickets, and for children. You can check prices on the various bus company websites here. Bus Travel During Turkish Holidays During Turkish national and Muslim holidays, buses fill to capacity, and the roads are busy with travelers. This also causes higher accident rates than other days of the year. It is safest to avoid travel during these times, but if you must, make your reservation at least one day in advance, earlier if possible. Short-haul Inter-city Buses These short routes are usually run by smaller local companies or by cooperatives between nearby towns. They may also go to nearby popular sights, running at least hourly every day during daylight hours. They are certainly a more affordable alternative to renting a car. You can take one of these buses to, for example, a nearby ancient site or beach, stay as long as you want, then take the same bus back. Be sure to ask when the last bus returns. See Also Turkish for Bus Travel: Basic Turkish you should know when using the long-distance bus system in Turkey. Short-haul Inter-city Bus Travel City Buses in Turkey: A guide to traveling by municipal bus. The Dolmuş: A guide to using privately owned mini-buses, or jitneys.
  3. New Travel Friends One or more men will find a reason to start a conversation, by asking you the time or saying something to you in Turkish. When you reply, they will address you in English. Coincidentally, they will be going your way or offer to show you around. They may even travel with you for a while. At some point they will offer you candy or gum laced with a knockout drug. On a train or bus, it will appear to everyone else that you simply went to sleep. Then at an opportune moment, they will relieve you of your money, credit cards, and anything else you have of value. They may even take your luggage. Let's Go to a Bar I Know In this scenario, a one or more men will approach you and talk about a great bar he wants to take you to, where there are beautiful women. The workers at the bar will also be in on the scam. Some of these bars are called paviyon or gazino (not to be confused with "casino"). Paviyons and Gazinos can range from hole-in-the-wall bars to extravagant night clubs. They have women working there as "hostesses," who chat up the male customers and get them to spend as much money as possible. The price for your drink will probably be at least double what you would normally pay, and drinks bought for the women may be five to eight times more expensive than usual. They are actually legitimate businesses, even with their outrageous prices. What your new friend(s), and the bar owner will be counting on is that you don't know this. After an evening with your friend and whatever women sit at your table, your friend will disappear and the bill will come. It may be 1,000, 2,000, or even 3,000 TL, and they will demand immediate payment. Because you probably won't know exactly where you are, you will be at a complete disadvantage. If you don't have the cash, they will demand your credit card and run the charge on it, and even walk you to the nearest bank machine to take out cash to pay the bill. Your new friend will return later to the bar get his commission. Technically, this isn't illegal. Someone stiffing you with a bar bill doesn't really rise to the level of a crime. If you were to ask the price of the drinks first, and make it clear that you were not buying drinks for your friend or any of the women, the barman will probably just be disgusted, the women will go sit somewhere else, and your friend will storm off to find another victim. That is, unless they spike your drink. Drink Spiking In this case, you will be taken to a bar exactly as in the previous scenario, but at some point either the barman or one of your "friends" will spike your drink with a knockout drug. When aroused, you will be highly open to suggestion. You will then be taken to the office and relieved of your cash and credit cards, then taken to a bank machine, and instructed to withdraw as much money as you can. When you wake up the next day, who knows where, you won't remember anything. Your credit cards will be in your wallet, and you won't know how bad the damage is until you get a credit card bill for hundreds or thousands of dollars. If you do happen to run in to your "friends" again, or return to the bar, they will tell you that you became very drunk, acted horribly, and bought drinks for everyone in the bar over and over again. They will do this to lessen the chance that you will report what happened, and hope you will just forget about it. How to Keep from Being a Victim Never put anything in your mouth which is offered by new acquaintances. Say you're on a diet, don't like candy or gum, or put it somewhere "for later." Throw it away as soon as you have a chance. Make an excuse, say you have friends waiting for you. Or just leave offering no explanation at all. Rather than go to the place they want to take you, insist on going to a mainstream bar or cafe in a public place, of your choosing. If they balk at this idea and keep trying to talk you in to going to their bar, it's a sure sign that they have bad intentions. Get away from them. If You Become a Victim Report it to the police. If you have simply been stiffed with an exorbitant bill, the police may or may not act. But it may also be that the police are fed up with this particular bar and are just waiting for the next case to do something about it. A police report will also help getting your money back from the credit card company. If you have been drugged, the drug typically used is metabolized quickly by the body, but may still be present in your blood the next day. The police may or may not have you give a blood and urine sample. That will all depend on how serious the local police take it. They may just say "you should have been more careful" and do nothing, but if you don't report it, it is certain that they will do nothing. Contact your credit card company and explain what happened. In one case, a man in Adana, who was taken to paviyon, drugged, and had unauthorized charges racked up on his card returned to the bar. He obtained the price of the various drinks, then informed the credit card company that he would have to have bought 400 cognacs (their most expensive drink) or some 3,000 beers in the three hours he was there (using testimony of workers at bar where he was previously and the time of the charge to frame the time). The credit card company disapproved the charges and refunded all of his money. See Also Crime, Safety, and Terrorism in Turkey Forum: If you have questions or comments about this topic, please post them in our forum.
  4. Where in Turkey were you today? What did you see? let's add one photo to share the moment and encourage others to get out and about. Yesterday we were walking the dogs around Lake Eğirdir in Isparta province
  5. Çıktı: Departed. Dakika: Minute (60 seconds). Dolu: Full, reserved. Firma: Firm, company. Fiyat: Fare, price. Haraket: Movement, departure. Hareket Yeri: Departure place. Hareket Tarihi: Departure date. Internet Fiyatı: Internet price. Kalkış: Departure. Kalkış Yeri: Departure place. Kalkış Saati: Departure time Liste Fiyatı: Listed fare (list price). Normal Fiyatı: Normal (standard) fare. Otogar: Bus station. Peron: Gate, departure gate. Varış: Arrival. Varış Yeri: Arrival place Kalkış: Departure Kalkış-Varış: Departure-arrival, round-trip ticket. KM: Kilometers. Otobüs Tipi: Bus type. Saat: Time, hour. Sefer: Trip. Sefer Listesi: Trip listing. Sefer Tipi: Journey type. Sefer Durakları: Journey stops (number of stops along the way). Sefer No., Sefer Numarasi: Trip number. Sefer Sorgulama: Trip inquiry, normally the button on a website which takes to to the page where you can book a trip. Teknobus: A bus equipped with wireless internet. Transfer: transfer. Travego: Standard long-distance bus. Internet Fiyatı: Internet fare Aradığınız kriterlere oygun sever bulunamamıştır: No journeys were found which meet your criteria. Uygun: Avalilable, seats available. Yolcu: Trip, journey. Yolculu: Passenger. Yolculuk Süresi: Trip duration. See Also Turkish Language Forum: Our forum for the Turkish language. If you have any questions, please ask them there.
  6. Refueling stations (called a benzinci or a petrol istasiyonu) all over Turkey usually sell two octane grades of unleaded gasoline (benzin), and diesel (dizel or mazot). Some also care Euro deisel. At a Turkish petrol station, there will usually be a market where you can buy drinks, snacks, and auto accessories. Some have automatic car washes. At others, you can ask an attendant to wash your car for a small fee, and even vacuum clean the interior. All Turkish petrol stations are full-service. An attendant will come out to ask you what you want, refill your car, and usually clean the windshield. You can also ask him to check the oil and air pressure in your tires. A small tip for these additional services is customary. If you are driving for long distances or plan to use a lot of fuel, you can rent a car with an engine which runs on diesel or Euro diesel fuel. While the cost of renting one of these cars is higher, the fuel is much cheaper, so paying more for a more efficient engine may save you money in the long run. While practically all petrol stations in Turkey have diesel, not all of them sell Euro diesel. You may have to visit a few stations to find one that sells it. Euro diesel cars (like diesel cars) have a specially-designed receptacle which will only accept a Euro diesel nozzle. Because of the high cost of petrol in Turkey, it isn't a good idea to rent a car for long, cross-country trips, unless you plan to make a lot of sight-seeing stops along the way. A better alternative is to take a bus or a flight for the long portions of your trip, then rent a car for local excursions. See Also Cars, Car Insurance, and Driving in Turkey Forum: The place to post questions and comments about driving in Turkey.
  7. Car Rental Prices The least expensive rental cars in Turkey are compact cars with manual (stick shift) transmissions and small engines which run on unleaded gasoline. They cost around 40 to 70 TL per day, and the cost goes up from there if you want a larger car, a van, an automatic transmission, or a diesel engine. If you are carrying passengers and luggage, planning to drive in mountainous areas, or on secondary roads where you will need to quickly pass trucks and other slow-moving vehicles, opt for a car with a larger engine. The cost of a rental car in Turkey will also vary according to time of year (with prices being higher during peak season), as well as the amount of time you are renting the car for. There are discounts for renting for more than a week. If you want to drop off the car in a place other than where you rented it, you will also have to pay for someone to come out to pick it up again. Large and Small Companies Small, local car rental businesses usually offer lower rates than the international chains. Besides the latest model cars, they also have older cars that you can rent at a bargain price. However, if you have a problem and you're far away from the place where you rented it, a small company will only be able to assist you over the phone, whereas a larger company with multiple locations may be able to bring you a replacement car. Child Safety Seats You can rent a child safety seat for around 10 TL per day at most rental car outlets. You should arrange this at least a day in advance so they can make sure one is available. When to Use a Rental Car Gasoline is very expensive in Turkey, and you will probably pay more for gasoline every day than you pay for the rental car itself. If you are traveling for a long distance to see some far-flung sight, take a bus and get to a nearby bus station first. Then rent a car locally. You should only rent a car to travel long distances if you want to see and explore multiple places during your journey. If there is a popular sight anywhere near the town where you're staying, there will probably be a regular buses and a dolmuş service to get you there. If you use these services, you can go to the site, spend the day, then catch the bus or dolmuş back to town. It will cost you a fraction of what you would spend on a rental car. Where to Rent a Car Rental Car Company Offices Practically every city and town in Turkey has rental car offices.You can usually just walk in, fill out the forms, and drive away. However, during peak tourist seasons you should reserve the car at least one day in advance. Hotels and Pensions Most hotels and pensions in Turkey have a car rental company they deal with. Your hotel or pension manager can probably reserve a car for you and have it delivered to the hotel, where you can fill out the rental forms on the spot. Then when you're ready to leave, the car rental company will come and pick it up. Airports All commercial airports in Turkey have rental car outlets. If you want a car to be waiting for you when your plane lands, reserve one in advance. What You'll Need to Rent a Car in Turkey Be 21 to 75 years old Have a valid passport with current visa Have a valid driver's license from your home country issued for at least the past two years. No international driving license is required for citizens of the US, UK, or European countries. If you are from another country, check with your local Turkish embassy or consulate. Have a valid credit card (you will probably be required to use the card to assure a deposit, even if you are paying cash) A deposit, usually around 20% of the total fee or around 500 TL. This can take the form of a pre-approved credit card transaction which will be destroyed when you return the car Note: Under Turkish law, if you have been a resident of Turkey for six months or more, you must have a Turkish driving license to drive a car. While a company may rent you a car without one, if you have an accident, the insurance company may refuse to pay out because you were driving illegally. Fuel In Turkey, rental car fuel tanks are usually empty (sometimes dangerously so) when received. Your first stop will need to be at a nearby petrol station, unless you have arranged to have a full tank in advance. You will be expected to return the car with the same level of fuel in the tank. Fuel stations in Turkey sell Diesel (Dizel or Mazot), unleaded (kurşunsuz [ker-shoon-sooz]), and at some stations, Euro diesel. If you will be doing a lot of driving, the cheaper diesel fuels can save you money, even though a diesel or Euro diesel car is more expensive to rent. Using a GPS in Turkey You can bring your own GPS and use it while traveling by car in Turkey. Before you leave, however, you may need to buy and download a GPS map for Turkey from the manufacturer's website. Turkey is well covered by the GPS maps of the major GPS suppliers. Toll Roads, Tunnels and Bridges A few toll highways in Turkey have automated toll booths. You cannot pay the toll in cash-you need to have a Hızlı Geçiş Sistemi (huz-luh geh-jeesh see-steh-mee) or HGS (heh-geh-seh) toll transponder to pay the tolls. Bridges going in and out of Istanbul also use the HGS system. Bridges and tunnels in other parts of Turkey have tolls collected by local municipalities and private contractors, so they accept cash. Ask your rental car company if your driving itinerary requires an HGS transponder. They usually have some cars with these transponders already mounted. If you don't want to take the toll highways, you can also use secondary highways which run alongside, but you will need to spot the exit for these before you get so close to the entrance of the toll highway that you can't turn around. If you do happen to go through a toll booth without a transponder, an alarm will sound and a camera will photograph your car and its license plate. The fine is ten times the toll. The tolls are usually around 2 TL, so expect a fine of around 20 TL. See Also Car Rental Insurance in Turkey: A guide help you understand car rental insurance, and make sure you have the right coverage. Cars, Car Insurance, and Driving in Turkey Forum: Our forum for all things cars and driving. If you have a question, please ask it there.
  8. Ken Grubb

    Driving in Turkey

    When you first start driving in Turkey, it can be a little scary, especially if you are from Europe, the UK, or the USA, where traffic laws are more closely followed and more strictly enforced. It might take you a few days to get used to it. Here's some useful information to help you get to that point. Driving in Turkey with a Foreign Driving License You can drive in Turkey on a foreign license for up to six months. So if you are in Turkey on holiday, and want to rent a car, your foreign license is fine. But if you live in Turkey, once you reach six months of residence, you must get a Turkish driving license. If you drive with a foreign license after being a resident of Turkey for six months, you can not only expect to be fined for doing so, but if you have an accident, your insurance company won't pay out. And most reputable car rental companies won't rent a car to foreigners who have had a residence permit for more than six months but don't have a Turkish driving license. What You Must Have In Your Car You must have a first aid kit and a reflective warning triangle in your car. If you are renting a car, these should be provided. A fire extinguisher is not mandatory, but a very good idea, as is a tow rope or cable, jumper cable, and snow chains if you are in an area subject to snowfall. You can get these kinds of accessories in kits at most petrol stations and home improvement stores. Speed Limits in Turkey Speed limits are in kilometers per hour. They are not always posted-you are usually expected to know the speed limit according to where you are. They are as follows: 120 KPH: Major highways and toll roads. You will see this posted when you enter a major highway. 90 KPH: On normal highways and secondary roads outside of city or town limits. 50 KPH: Within city or town limits. You will know when you are in a town when you see a blue sign with white letters with the name of the town on it. Reduce your speed to 50 KPH. When you leave the town, you will see the same sign with a red slash across it. At this point you may increase your speed to 90 KPH. You will see speed limit signs posted in areas where reduced speed is required because of a curve, grade, road construction or other special circumstance. Tips for Safer Driving in Turkey Many Turks drive with the "nose-in" rule. That is, if they can get the front of their car in ahead of yours, they have the right of way. This is not literally true, but the driving reflects the philosophy. Here are some tips for safe driving: Expect the unexpected. Don't assume other drivers will act or react the way a reasonably intelligent person would. Drive defensively Wear safety belts Put children in the back seat, in child safety seats if appropriate Use your signals, but don't expect others to use them, or heed them. Use your horn and lights to alert other motorists and pedestrians of your approach. If you are in the back of a traffic slow-down or traffic jam, turn on your emergency flashers to warn drivers approaching from behind. Keep your car, including lights, turn signals, and horn, in good working condition. Avoid driving in rain, snow, or at night. If you must do so, be extra alert. If confronted by another driver with "road rage," lock your doors, roll up your windows, and get away if you can. Call the police when you can do so safely. Watch your rear-view mirrors, especially the right one. Double check with a glance. Watch for vehicles in your blind spot, Turkish drivers seldom avoid them. Don't expect other drivers, especially those driving trucks or buses, to give you the right of way, even if you are supposed to have it. What You Can Expect Passing on the right. Passing on the left, even when you are signalling and preparing to make a left turn. Passing on blind curves. Passing you when you are passing someone else. Sudden stops, without pulling off the roadway, by drivers unloading cargo or passengers. Sudden turns without signalling. Sudden lane changes. Left turns from the right lane and right turns from the left lane. Inattentive drivers in a hurry, especially during rush hour. Inattentive (even oblivious) pedestrians running or walking into traffic. Drivers using their horn or lights. It usually means "I'm coming through, or "get out of my way!" Vehicles parked on the road lights off. Vehicles with no lights at night. Slow-moving tractors or horse-drawn carriages without reflectors or lights at night. Inattentive or unskilled drivers. Rocks or tree branches in the road. In rural areas these are used as a substitute for a reflective warning triangle. Smooth pavement with little traction, especially when raining or snowing. Vehicles traveling in reverse, especially on exit ramps. Vehicles driving on the wrong side of the road. Flashing of high-beams at oncoming traffic or leaving high-beams on. Vehicles following too close, flashing headlights and sounding of the horn when you are in the left lane of a highway. Unregulated intersections. As a general rule, the larger street has the right of way, or is supposed to anyway. Emergency Telephone Numbers Ambulance: 112 Traffic Police: 154 Police: 155 Jandarma: 156 What To Do In Case of an Accident If you have a traffic accident in the city, call the traffic police. If you are in a rural area, call the Jandarma. Call an ambulance if there are any injuries. Don't move your vehicle. This can be interpreted as tampering with the accident scene, or even fleeing. Aid the injured, warn oncoming traffic, and wait for the police. Car Repairs In cities, the car repair shops are in an industrial area on the outskirts of the city, called a sanayı (sah-nah-yuh), or industrial zone. In these areas you will have many car repair shops to choose from. Driving During Turkish Holidays During Ramazan (Ramadan), most Turks fast from dawn till dusk. They do not eat, drink (even water), or smoke. This lack of food, caffeine, and nicotine can make for very inattentive driving and short tempers, especially at the end of the day. Şeker Bayram (Sugar Holiday) is a week of eating, drinking, and visiting family which comes just after the end of Ramazan. Accident rates during this time are much higher than the rest of the year, because of the number of vehicles on the road. Other major holiday periods are also more dangerous times to drive. See Also Turkish for Driving: Basic Turkish words and phrases which can help you while you're on the road. Cars, Car Insurance, and Driving in Turkey Forum: If you have a question about driving in Turkey, please ask it in the forum.
  9. A new documentary has been released talking about the Laz and Hemsin communities of the Black Sea region of Turkey. Expats with friends from that area might be interested in it and I am certain, people from Rize and Trabzon will. Called Dance the Past into the Future, it is in Turkish with English subtitles. See my review here : http://turkishtravelblog.com/laz-hemsin-turkey/ Or watch the trailer on Vimeo
  10. Good day! Pardon me if the question was given in the past. I have been scouring the net trying to look for a page which could enlighten me of detailed information and some led me here. I am a Filipina and planning to move to Turkey for good. Anyways, my Turkish boyfriend and I are in a long-distance-relationship for almost a year now. He asked me to visit Turkey in a tourist visa so we could get married in his country. I am honestly so puzzled of the idea. Is there no way that I can get a fiancee visa instead? Applying for a tourist requires big money and more effort. In addition, Turkish embassy in the Philippines is very strict in requirements compliance. Don't get me wrong, we both have stable jobs and even if he gave me guarantees, I am still not confident of it. I already checked the e-visa, unfortunately, not applicable in my country. I would like to get more alternative before going to the embassy. Please help me out :-(
  11. I've been keeping in touch with our member RovingJay for some time about her upcoming travel guide to the Bodrum peninsula. What a great work, I think it's the best guide I've ever seen of the Bodrum area, coming from someone who has read a LOT of travel guide. Finally it's finished, downloadable as an e-book from Amazon.com. Have a look, you'll see what I mean. And congratulations RovingJay, you have done a splendid job! Bodrum Peninsula Travel Guide on Amazon.com
  12. Hi All , Im flying in to Istanbul this time instead of flying to Ankara as my partner would like me to take the bus/coach through the country to Aksaray. I know i must be barking as its already been pointed out to me why take a 10hr bus journey when i could get to Ankara by plane in just 1 hr ? The reason why is Turkey as we all know is a vast country and this time i am going for 3 weeks and this will be an opportunity for me to travel through the central regions and actually see a good part of the Turkey. Next time I can visit the southern regions then next time i could travel north etc etc etc but by plane im going to miss all this . Anyway getting back to my question which will probably be difficult to answer is - From actually leaving my front door at 0350am to landing at Istanbul subject to no delays I would have been on the road for many hours and not having any sleep the night i leave im going to be tired so i was thinking if i really need to stop off and take a break i would like to know if anyone knows of a suitable town/city that is approx 4-5 hours east of Istanbul? The hard bit is i dont know what route the bus will take but we could always get off at a town somewhere and get another bus/taxi to a location anyone on here can suggest. My partner is not a traveller in his own country and he says he is more than happy to stop off overnight somewhere but he doesnt know where because he's never done it and it appears they dont use maps simpley because they dont need one, they dont travel further than their front door lol. So if anyone can think of a town in the central region approx 4-5hrs from Istanbul then i'd love to hear from you just incase .Probably i will be so tired i'll sleep through the journey and miss the whole lot and so i might as well as flown anyway lol xx
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