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saffron

Isparta
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  1. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Silkroute in Catching My Local Bakkal Cheating Foreigners (me!)   
    Thank you Ken, and I think this is a very good idea. Before writing this post I took a quick look at the legislation concerning foundation of non-profit organizations. In the Turkish Civil Code and the Law of Associaitons, it is openly stated that foreigners, with real or artificial personality, can found or join an associaiton. The only thing requested from a foriegner to join an association is the residence permit. In other words any one who has the legal right to live here can found or join this type of non-profit organizations. (Opening a branch of a foreign-based organization is another issue and subject to prior approval of the Minisitry of Interior).
    In order to start an association, there must be at least 7 founding members..
    Only 7 people, after completing the necessary documents- like evidence of ownership or rent of an office, details of the founders, which, in the case of a foreigner the evidence of nationality, present them to the relevant authorirty, and upon this presentation, the associaiton is deemed to have been found legally. No prior approval is needed.. the association can open branch offices in other locations as well with at least three people.
    As far as I know form a few association managers I talked to before, the most important thing to pay attention is limiting the activities to the stated purpose. Even with all the good intend, any activity sounding not relevant to the original purpose may put the organization into risk.
    I think this would be indeed a very good attempt. Not only expats or toursits, also the businessmen who want to carry out their job in a honest and fair way would benefit from this greatly, they too suffer, because of unfair competition..
    In the long run, every body involved would benefit...
  2. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in arkadaşlar help me please! (-Suffixes)   
    Iky, I have a story for you..
    Just imagine yourself struggling with the verb structures (voices). The last thing you have learned is the passive voice, ‘oh it is simple’ you say, ‘bilmek is to know, bilinmek is to be known, that’s it! Then you try other verbs, görmek-görünmek, ‘yeah, sure, to see and to be seen! But there is a problem. You recall that there is görülmek, too. ‘If görünmek is to be seen, what is görülmek, then?’How many to-be-seens are there in Turkish?
     
    With no answer in your mind, you fall asleep on the chair you are studying.. In your restless sleep, the verbs come to your dream, one by one, challenging you: ‘Put us into passive voice!’ As you feel cold sleeping on the chair, you say ‘ok, let me try to put on something : Giymek, and giyinmek. ‘Really?’ yells your jacket from the corner you threw, ‘let me see how you put me on!’
    -Why, ceketimi giydim’
    -Good. Now make it passive.
    - Ceketim giyindi
    -Ha ha ha ! a laughter comes from your wardrobe, ‘what did your jacket put on? Another jacket? Ha ha a jacket with four sleeves!
    -???
     
    In Turkish folk tales, a white bearded old man has the habit of visiting people to help, in their dreams..
    This time an old Turkish grammarian comes to you:
    -Ok, my son, what is your problem?
    You ask hurriedly, before he disappears:
    - Is giyinmek the passive voice of giymek?
    -Nope.
    -Why bilinmek is passive, then?
    -Because it is passive. And you have one more question left.
    -What is giyinmek, then?
    -My, son, my time  has almost expired. I can only give you a clue: It is neither intransitive, nor transitive.
    -WHAT? Neither transitive nor intransitive?
    -Do it yourself, says the old man and goes out of sight.
     
    Excited by his visit, you wake up, and start studying again..
    Humm. What was a transitive verb? It takes a direct object, ok. The action effects that object, good. I paint something or drive my car, they are effected, simple. And the intransitive. No direct object. I walk, it rains, peace followed, ok, what is so confusing here? If I put on my jacket, my jacket is effected by my action (maybe I shouldn’t have thrown it away like a bag). But nothing is effected when I say giyinmek yet it is not intransitive! Just a minute, what did the old man say? Do it yourself. A-ha! Yourself! That’s the clue! I dressed myself! It is me who is effected! I am doing something and I am effected by it as well! Giyindim: I dressed myself, but it seems Turks don’t say ‘myself’ but they use one of their magical suffixes
     
    Now you feel relaxed and decide to go out to get some fresh air. Don’t forget to put on your clever jacket, it is almost November now.
  3. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in arkadaşlar help me please! (-Suffixes)   
    Faruk'la sık sık mektuplaşırız : 'We exchange letters with Faruk often', so this is the answer you need. Here, 'leş/laş' denotes that there is a mutual activity going on , like selamlaşmak : to exchange greetings; however, you can confuse it with the suffix ış/iş/uş/üş which have a similar function, like in: Faruk'la sık sık yazışırız : We exchange letters (or any other written material) with Faruk often, here the suffix -ış follows the verb yaz+mak; Faruk'la sık sık görüşürüz : We see each other with Faruk often (we meet often), here the suffix -üş follows the verb 'gör+mek'; Faruk'la sık sık buluşuruz , again the suffix -uş fallows the verb 'bulmak'= to find; again what is meant is meeting; thinking Turkishwise, 'we find each other', so  a mutual activity is going on, they 'find' each other, i.e., they meet..
     
    The other examples are about the function of 'becoming':
    güzelleşmek: to become beautiful
    beyazlaşmak: to turn to white (to become white)
    iyileşmek : to recover (to become better)
  4. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in Help with a couple of phrases   
    You're welcome
    And let me write a short explantion why it should be 'gelmeyi'. 'Gelme' is one of the nouns ( noun of an action) that can be driven from the verb to come, 'gelmek' , and it is the object of the sentence. As an object it is not supposed to be in infinitive form, unlike English, where you can say 'think to come'. But still you can compare:' I thought about cutting my hair', but not '..about to cut'.
    It is not only the object, but  the direct object, this is why it takes 'i': Gelme +y+i , where y is a buffer, as you know I guess. (Being the direct object is not the only reason but I don't want to be confusing on this mere example)
  5. Like
    saffron got a reaction from emreoz in Help with a couple of phrases   
    Hi Ken! I'm surprised to see you here with a question!
    Geleceği sahi mi , a colloquial expression, a standard version of which is 'sahiden gelecek mi?'means, yes, 'will s/he really come/ is  s/he really coming?'
    Kalacakları iyi: this is something in between colloquial and substandard Turkish. The right version is 'kalacak olmaları iyi' which means 'that they will stay is good. Yes, they will stay in future. If it were 'kalmaları iyi', we couldn't tell if they stay or stayed or will stay. We could understand it only when we complete the sentence with the verb: Kalmaları iyi oldu:  'It was good that they stayed'; Kalmaları iyi olacak : it will be good if they stay; Kalmaları iyi /iyidir : It is good that they stay.
    Kalmayacağınız iyi olmadı : Likewise , the standard version is: Kalmayacak olmanız iyi olmadı, The first part 'kalmayacak olmanız': that you will not stay / the fact that you will not stay. In the second part, the use of 'olmak' conveys a meaning that the speaker has not expected that. He expected that they would stay. If we say 'kalmayacak olmanız kötü, it means:' that you will not stay is not good'. But here, by conjugating 'olmak' in that form , we draw attention to an outcome, like 'proved to be' /it so happened.
  6. Like
    saffron got a reaction from mckenzie in Please help me translate my English letter to Turkish   
    (I copied this part to read easily while translating)

    Hi Orhan,

    Hope you are doing good. I would like to ask a favor if it's alright with you. Is it possible for you to send me your family picture? Or any picture of your mom and dad please?

    It's your brother's birthday next month and I remember he was trying to find a picture of your parents on his account and your Facebook but he cant find one. So I am thinking, if you will send me your family picture or just your mom and dad's picture, I will use it to ask someone to paint it in a portrait.

    Ayhan misses your family and that will be my gift for him on his birthday. Please don't let him know that I asked you, if we can keep this as a secret so he will be surprise. I know he will be so much happy, so please help me?

    You can send it in my Facebook or better in my email, just scan the pictures so I can bring it to the painter....
    I will appreciate your help and I can return the favor and don't hesitate to ask if you need my help. I will be waiting for your reply if you will send me these photos..
    Also if you can find even one of his baby pictures. Thank you so much and please please do send me.

    Hi mckenzie, I waited for somebody else to translate it for you, as I don't lead this forum as I did before..
    But I see nobody around to help you. So here is the translation you need:
    Merhaba Orhan
    Umarım iyisindir ( ' inşallah iyisindir ' sounds more natural, as most of the Turks use it this way. But young people may prefer not to use 'inşallah' as it sounds like an old fashioned expression to them). Eğer senin için sakıncası yoksa senden bir şey isteyeceğim( please note,this is not a literal translation, for instance, don't try to find a word similar to 'favour' here). Bana bir aile resmi gönderebilir misin? Ya da annenle babanın resmini?
    Gelecek ay erkek kardeşinin doğum günü var, kendi hesabında ve senin facebook'unda annenle babanın (parents mean 'ebeveyn' but this word is used only on formal occassions, we say mother and father instead) bir resmini bulmaya çalıştığını ama bulamadığını anımsıyorum. Ben de şöyle düşündüm: Eğer ailenin ya da annenle babanın bir resmini gönderebilirsen, birisinden bu resme bakarak bir portre yapmasını isteyebilirim.
    Ayhan aileni (if Ayhan and the person you are writing to are brothers, ailesini = his family is better, when Turkish style is concerned) özlüyor ve bu benim ona doğum günü hediyem olacak. Ama lütfen ona senden istediğim şeyi söyleme, bunu sır olarak saklayabilirsek sürpriz olacak. Çok sevineceğini biliyorum, onun için lütfen bana yardımcı ol!
    Resimleri skan ettirip facebook ya da daha iyisi e-postama gönderebilirsin, ben de ressama götürürüm. Yardımına çok memnun olacağım ve karşılığını verebilirim , benden istediğin bir şey varsa lütfen çekinme, söyle! Bana bu fotorafları göndermen, hatta varsa bir bebeklik resmini bulman mümkün mü değil mi, bu konuda cevabını bekliyorum. Çok teşekkür ederim, lütfen,lütfen bana bu resimleri gönder!
  7. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in Question about Seker Bayram   
    This topic will probably draw attention many times..so let me write a few ways that you can use on similar occassions..
    First of all, Turks don't say 'bayramlar kutlu olsun'. Instead, they say 'bayramınız kutlu olsun'. This is for more than one person, I mean plural, or simply formal. To your friend 'bayramın kutlu olsun' is ok.
    This expression can be used for any special holiday, religous or official doesn't matter. For instance you can say 'şeker bayramınız - ramazan bayramızın kutlu olsun, kurban bayramınız kutlu olsun, cumhuriyet bayramınız kutlu olsun, etc. Şeker bayramı is a common name for the special three days following the ramazan month, when fasting is over. The people who pay more attention to the religious terminology prefer to use the term 'ramazan bayramı'. But it is also commonly called şeker (candy - sugar) bayramı, as candies make that day special. It is a traditon to offer good quality candies, in particular to children, who even visit houses to kiss the hands of adults saying 'bayramınız kutlu olsun and recieve enough candies to fill their pockets, in return. This traditon is so deeply rooted and respected that, in some regions, people go to public cemeteries , on 'şeker bayramı' and leave bags of candies, just to let the children come and take away..
    Why cemeteries? Probably the souls of deceased children are somehow considered here. Turks had shamanistic believes before Islam, and that culture was rich in traditions related with souls.

    Elderly people prefer to say 'mübarek olsun' instead of 'kutlu olsun'. Both mean blessed, but first one (Arabic) sounds more Islamic. In these days, as religion is part of political life and thought, 'mübarek olsun' is trendy. As an expat, you don't need to worry about it, 'kutlu olsun' is ok for you.

    Alternatively, you may simply say 'iyi bayramlar'. This expression has no religious reference, it is simply a wish for a good holiday. But this is used mostly when you leave a place. If you visit your neighbour on a religious holiday, 'bayramınız kutlu olsun' is among the first words to be said, not 'iyi bayramlar'. But when you leave the shop you visit right before the hoilday or in it, you can say 'iyi bayramlar' , not as the first words, like 'have a good..' Or if you happen to meet a Turkish friend on your way, you can say 'iyi bayramlar' at the end of conversation.
  8. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Meral in Please help me translate my English letter to Turkish   
    (I copied this part to read easily while translating)

    Hi Orhan,

    Hope you are doing good. I would like to ask a favor if it's alright with you. Is it possible for you to send me your family picture? Or any picture of your mom and dad please?

    It's your brother's birthday next month and I remember he was trying to find a picture of your parents on his account and your Facebook but he cant find one. So I am thinking, if you will send me your family picture or just your mom and dad's picture, I will use it to ask someone to paint it in a portrait.

    Ayhan misses your family and that will be my gift for him on his birthday. Please don't let him know that I asked you, if we can keep this as a secret so he will be surprise. I know he will be so much happy, so please help me?

    You can send it in my Facebook or better in my email, just scan the pictures so I can bring it to the painter....
    I will appreciate your help and I can return the favor and don't hesitate to ask if you need my help. I will be waiting for your reply if you will send me these photos..
    Also if you can find even one of his baby pictures. Thank you so much and please please do send me.

    Hi mckenzie, I waited for somebody else to translate it for you, as I don't lead this forum as I did before..
    But I see nobody around to help you. So here is the translation you need:
    Merhaba Orhan
    Umarım iyisindir ( ' inşallah iyisindir ' sounds more natural, as most of the Turks use it this way. But young people may prefer not to use 'inşallah' as it sounds like an old fashioned expression to them). Eğer senin için sakıncası yoksa senden bir şey isteyeceğim( please note,this is not a literal translation, for instance, don't try to find a word similar to 'favour' here). Bana bir aile resmi gönderebilir misin? Ya da annenle babanın resmini?
    Gelecek ay erkek kardeşinin doğum günü var, kendi hesabında ve senin facebook'unda annenle babanın (parents mean 'ebeveyn' but this word is used only on formal occassions, we say mother and father instead) bir resmini bulmaya çalıştığını ama bulamadığını anımsıyorum. Ben de şöyle düşündüm: Eğer ailenin ya da annenle babanın bir resmini gönderebilirsen, birisinden bu resme bakarak bir portre yapmasını isteyebilirim.
    Ayhan aileni (if Ayhan and the person you are writing to are brothers, ailesini = his family is better, when Turkish style is concerned) özlüyor ve bu benim ona doğum günü hediyem olacak. Ama lütfen ona senden istediğim şeyi söyleme, bunu sır olarak saklayabilirsek sürpriz olacak. Çok sevineceğini biliyorum, onun için lütfen bana yardımcı ol!
    Resimleri skan ettirip facebook ya da daha iyisi e-postama gönderebilirsin, ben de ressama götürürüm. Yardımına çok memnun olacağım ve karşılığını verebilirim , benden istediğin bir şey varsa lütfen çekinme, söyle! Bana bu fotorafları göndermen, hatta varsa bir bebeklik resmini bulman mümkün mü değil mi, bu konuda cevabını bekliyorum. Çok teşekkür ederim, lütfen,lütfen bana bu resimleri gönder!
  9. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Abi in Please help me translate my English letter to Turkish   
    (I copied this part to read easily while translating)

    Hi Orhan,

    Hope you are doing good. I would like to ask a favor if it's alright with you. Is it possible for you to send me your family picture? Or any picture of your mom and dad please?

    It's your brother's birthday next month and I remember he was trying to find a picture of your parents on his account and your Facebook but he cant find one. So I am thinking, if you will send me your family picture or just your mom and dad's picture, I will use it to ask someone to paint it in a portrait.

    Ayhan misses your family and that will be my gift for him on his birthday. Please don't let him know that I asked you, if we can keep this as a secret so he will be surprise. I know he will be so much happy, so please help me?

    You can send it in my Facebook or better in my email, just scan the pictures so I can bring it to the painter....
    I will appreciate your help and I can return the favor and don't hesitate to ask if you need my help. I will be waiting for your reply if you will send me these photos..
    Also if you can find even one of his baby pictures. Thank you so much and please please do send me.

    Hi mckenzie, I waited for somebody else to translate it for you, as I don't lead this forum as I did before..
    But I see nobody around to help you. So here is the translation you need:
    Merhaba Orhan
    Umarım iyisindir ( ' inşallah iyisindir ' sounds more natural, as most of the Turks use it this way. But young people may prefer not to use 'inşallah' as it sounds like an old fashioned expression to them). Eğer senin için sakıncası yoksa senden bir şey isteyeceğim( please note,this is not a literal translation, for instance, don't try to find a word similar to 'favour' here). Bana bir aile resmi gönderebilir misin? Ya da annenle babanın resmini?
    Gelecek ay erkek kardeşinin doğum günü var, kendi hesabında ve senin facebook'unda annenle babanın (parents mean 'ebeveyn' but this word is used only on formal occassions, we say mother and father instead) bir resmini bulmaya çalıştığını ama bulamadığını anımsıyorum. Ben de şöyle düşündüm: Eğer ailenin ya da annenle babanın bir resmini gönderebilirsen, birisinden bu resme bakarak bir portre yapmasını isteyebilirim.
    Ayhan aileni (if Ayhan and the person you are writing to are brothers, ailesini = his family is better, when Turkish style is concerned) özlüyor ve bu benim ona doğum günü hediyem olacak. Ama lütfen ona senden istediğim şeyi söyleme, bunu sır olarak saklayabilirsek sürpriz olacak. Çok sevineceğini biliyorum, onun için lütfen bana yardımcı ol!
    Resimleri skan ettirip facebook ya da daha iyisi e-postama gönderebilirsin, ben de ressama götürürüm. Yardımına çok memnun olacağım ve karşılığını verebilirim , benden istediğin bir şey varsa lütfen çekinme, söyle! Bana bu fotorafları göndermen, hatta varsa bir bebeklik resmini bulman mümkün mü değil mi, bu konuda cevabını bekliyorum. Çok teşekkür ederim, lütfen,lütfen bana bu resimleri gönder!
  10. Like
    saffron got a reaction from mrs in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    I somehow felt that a passion you had...
    Otherwise you wouldn't bother yourself with translation..
    I'm glad that I warned you before translation offices kill your passion !(just like they killed all my interest in English) Yes, Turkish is a 'logical' language, when you read the right material or write down something with a proper care given to Turkish, it gives a feeling that you are making a relaxing mental exercise..
    The influence of Arabic and Persian languages distorted the natural character of the language , a process not limited to words but covers sentence structure as well. This artificially created sentence structure still prevails in Turkish spoken by the educated people , who are not even aware of it. When you go to rural sites, Turkish sounds diffrerent: very fluent, to mention first. People have no difficulty to explain what they mean to each other, unlike the urban speakers of Turkish..
    When I talk , my own words sound so boring , among rural people, (not because of the vocabulary I use) so I keep quiet and only listen!
    I hope you improve your Turkish as you like and enjoy..
  11. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    If I understand you correctly, Paks, you want to give a chance to the idea of living in Turkey. So what would be the benefits and risks involved ? Let me try to be more spesific.
    If you are lucky enough, or you would have enough time to search, you can work for a good translation office as an editor. I cannot tell how many of them are there in the sector, but at least I know some number of good translation offices which prefer to work with a native speaker as editor. Some translators , including me , insistingly demanded native speakes as editors, and the idea didn't sound strange to at least a few office bosses. This trend must be stronger than before, I guess, but just a guess.
    But, needless to say, a native speaker-editor must have some qualifications as well. One side of it is translation background and the other side , obviously , knowledge in Turkish. An example: we had an editor, who had these features, but he didn't have enough 'native speaker sense', so his existence sometimes gave me headache, though I had expected just the reverse to occur. So the boss MUST be qualified as well, to know what is needed and why, and ensure a collaboration between the translator and editor. Where can you find him? Humm. Try İstanbul first. Ankara second, and for the other cities , the chances are weak.
    I said benefits and risks. I'm almost sure you can find a translation office where , after some experience, you will be appreciated and probably enjoy the career you have chosen. But the risk is spending too much time and effort until you find the right place. Or even giving up the idea on the way.
    You can use the advantage of being a native speaker of English, as Vic said, in many ways in Turkey, but ,oh, I don't want to discourage you but since I left Ankara,I have met virtually nobody who knows what I am or what I am supposed to do, when I say ' I am a translator-interpreter'. The best estimate was that I was a tourist guide. Sometimes I lost my patience and said 'do you know that the dam over there was built by a joint venture, as the government doesn't let the Turkish companies build a dam without cooperating with a foreign company, and I made the the translation needed by the joint venture, now water comes to you from that dam but you even don't know who is a translator!'
    Shortly, you may try İstanbul, and 'one day' you can find what you are looking for..
  12. Like
    saffron got a reaction from mrs in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    Well the person who told me on the phone that he was embarrassed was a veteran American general who hardly could say 'hello' in Turkish. How could I explain the semantic and technical concerns that the work included to him? I was so very annoyed that practically left the job, I didn't translate anymore line for that customer which therefore had to change the office he worked with, and soon I changed my office too. That stupid ignorance that put me so helpless, was and is not an exception in the translation business. language is not like mathematics, where you can prove it, if you are right. But how can I prove that I make the right choice depending only on my accumulated knowledge or experinece? No way. For any reason whatsoever the boss, the customer or even any other translator involved may choose the party who can say the right word or the final word on the issue. In the American general case, the customer-government office was supposed to be right, probably because the office was the customer of the American company and a government office . What the hell I was doing at my office calling myself a translator, then? The poor guy who was frustrated by women as a rule, had no idea about the difference between a semantic translation and fluent translation, otherwise he would only keep quiet.
    Another example: before accepting the job, I told the boss of a translation office that I wouldn't make any translation simply because I was asked to do so. I was badly needed there, so the boss had to accept my prerequest. One day a text to be translated was sent by the Ministry of Culture about the life of an Anatolian saint. Considering the importance of the customer, I was asked to do it. No, I said, give it to somebody who have some experience in that. As we agreed before, she accepted. Indeed, a few days later a very good, professionaly translated text was in my hand. I read it carefully, and told the boss that she can send it to the customer, confidently. Alas! Miss Secretary of Mr. somebody at the ministry hapenned to know this business better than me: One day the boss told me that the 'customer' was on the phone. 'Ok, what's wrong?' I asked. ' Miss secretary had noticed that somewhere in the text the letter 'n' somewhow was typed as 'r', which I missed. Miss Secretary told me very self confidently that 'Although I DON'T KNOW English, I noticed this this mistake, God knows how many other major mistakes must be in the text!' Reasoning? did you say reasoning? Forget it. In translation business reasoning is luxury.
    I can make this list long. The final is not a happy end. I struggled for my rights for years, I attempted to discuss with other translators, tried to convince them that we shouldn't be left so unreasonably alone. We should insist on our right for specialization, etc..
    To my great surprise, only one or two nodded , and only nodded .
    I said I worked at the best office. Why was it best? First, the boss was a rich man and thought that if he had paid a good wage, the best translators would come to him. Secondly, he was an exception in that, somehow he had learnt that translators needed good dictionaries, not an occassional one or two dictionaries in the office. If , today, he knows that it is not the dictionaries which solve the problem but the background of the translator who is supposed to pick up the right word, he owes this knowledge to me, but my patient to train him was finally over and left that office , too.
    I don't know what is going on in the business now, but if everything has remained the same, forget about that 'specialization' thing. Only very roughly, like medical or engineering type of translations, but don't look for an opportunity where you can translate the laws, regulations, but not balance sheets ( no dictionary in Turkish is available covering all the accounting terms, so this again should be solved by the translator by specialization) or letters of credit terms (don't forget that a very special jargon the banks use for foreign trade, abbreviations have special and important meanings, I was able to translate them right only owing to my bankground in banking business)or land management or insurance policies ( and don't forget: a wrong choice for a word in an insurance policy which is written down on purpose with a sophisticated legal jargon, may put you in serious trouble). If you are not lucky enough, you will do all of them, while at the same time translating a shampoo brochure, this time thinking 'should I use 'vivid' now?and thinking, too ,how you can translate an advertisment with all the serious faced style you have gained in your struggle to become a 'legal text translator'.
    In Turkish there is a saying I love 'he either doesn't know how to count or he has never been beaten up'.
  13. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    Well the person who told me on the phone that he was embarrassed was a veteran American general who hardly could say 'hello' in Turkish. How could I explain the semantic and technical concerns that the work included to him? I was so very annoyed that practically left the job, I didn't translate anymore line for that customer which therefore had to change the office he worked with, and soon I changed my office too. That stupid ignorance that put me so helpless, was and is not an exception in the translation business. language is not like mathematics, where you can prove it, if you are right. But how can I prove that I make the right choice depending only on my accumulated knowledge or experinece? No way. For any reason whatsoever the boss, the customer or even any other translator involved may choose the party who can say the right word or the final word on the issue. In the American general case, the customer-government office was supposed to be right, probably because the office was the customer of the American company and a government office . What the hell I was doing at my office calling myself a translator, then? The poor guy who was frustrated by women as a rule, had no idea about the difference between a semantic translation and fluent translation, otherwise he would only keep quiet.
    Another example: before accepting the job, I told the boss of a translation office that I wouldn't make any translation simply because I was asked to do so. I was badly needed there, so the boss had to accept my prerequest. One day a text to be translated was sent by the Ministry of Culture about the life of an Anatolian saint. Considering the importance of the customer, I was asked to do it. No, I said, give it to somebody who have some experience in that. As we agreed before, she accepted. Indeed, a few days later a very good, professionaly translated text was in my hand. I read it carefully, and told the boss that she can send it to the customer, confidently. Alas! Miss Secretary of Mr. somebody at the ministry hapenned to know this business better than me: One day the boss told me that the 'customer' was on the phone. 'Ok, what's wrong?' I asked. ' Miss secretary had noticed that somewhere in the text the letter 'n' somewhow was typed as 'r', which I missed. Miss Secretary told me very self confidently that 'Although I DON'T KNOW English, I noticed this this mistake, God knows how many other major mistakes must be in the text!' Reasoning? did you say reasoning? Forget it. In translation business reasoning is luxury.
    I can make this list long. The final is not a happy end. I struggled for my rights for years, I attempted to discuss with other translators, tried to convince them that we shouldn't be left so unreasonably alone. We should insist on our right for specialization, etc..
    To my great surprise, only one or two nodded , and only nodded .
    I said I worked at the best office. Why was it best? First, the boss was a rich man and thought that if he had paid a good wage, the best translators would come to him. Secondly, he was an exception in that, somehow he had learnt that translators needed good dictionaries, not an occassional one or two dictionaries in the office. If , today, he knows that it is not the dictionaries which solve the problem but the background of the translator who is supposed to pick up the right word, he owes this knowledge to me, but my patient to train him was finally over and left that office , too.
    I don't know what is going on in the business now, but if everything has remained the same, forget about that 'specialization' thing. Only very roughly, like medical or engineering type of translations, but don't look for an opportunity where you can translate the laws, regulations, but not balance sheets ( no dictionary in Turkish is available covering all the accounting terms, so this again should be solved by the translator by specialization) or letters of credit terms (don't forget that a very special jargon the banks use for foreign trade, abbreviations have special and important meanings, I was able to translate them right only owing to my bankground in banking business)or land management or insurance policies ( and don't forget: a wrong choice for a word in an insurance policy which is written down on purpose with a sophisticated legal jargon, may put you in serious trouble). If you are not lucky enough, you will do all of them, while at the same time translating a shampoo brochure, this time thinking 'should I use 'vivid' now?and thinking, too ,how you can translate an advertisment with all the serious faced style you have gained in your struggle to become a 'legal text translator'.
    In Turkish there is a saying I love 'he either doesn't know how to count or he has never been beaten up'.
  14. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Abi in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    Well the person who told me on the phone that he was embarrassed was a veteran American general who hardly could say 'hello' in Turkish. How could I explain the semantic and technical concerns that the work included to him? I was so very annoyed that practically left the job, I didn't translate anymore line for that customer which therefore had to change the office he worked with, and soon I changed my office too. That stupid ignorance that put me so helpless, was and is not an exception in the translation business. language is not like mathematics, where you can prove it, if you are right. But how can I prove that I make the right choice depending only on my accumulated knowledge or experinece? No way. For any reason whatsoever the boss, the customer or even any other translator involved may choose the party who can say the right word or the final word on the issue. In the American general case, the customer-government office was supposed to be right, probably because the office was the customer of the American company and a government office . What the hell I was doing at my office calling myself a translator, then? The poor guy who was frustrated by women as a rule, had no idea about the difference between a semantic translation and fluent translation, otherwise he would only keep quiet.
    Another example: before accepting the job, I told the boss of a translation office that I wouldn't make any translation simply because I was asked to do so. I was badly needed there, so the boss had to accept my prerequest. One day a text to be translated was sent by the Ministry of Culture about the life of an Anatolian saint. Considering the importance of the customer, I was asked to do it. No, I said, give it to somebody who have some experience in that. As we agreed before, she accepted. Indeed, a few days later a very good, professionaly translated text was in my hand. I read it carefully, and told the boss that she can send it to the customer, confidently. Alas! Miss Secretary of Mr. somebody at the ministry hapenned to know this business better than me: One day the boss told me that the 'customer' was on the phone. 'Ok, what's wrong?' I asked. ' Miss secretary had noticed that somewhere in the text the letter 'n' somewhow was typed as 'r', which I missed. Miss Secretary told me very self confidently that 'Although I DON'T KNOW English, I noticed this this mistake, God knows how many other major mistakes must be in the text!' Reasoning? did you say reasoning? Forget it. In translation business reasoning is luxury.
    I can make this list long. The final is not a happy end. I struggled for my rights for years, I attempted to discuss with other translators, tried to convince them that we shouldn't be left so unreasonably alone. We should insist on our right for specialization, etc..
    To my great surprise, only one or two nodded , and only nodded .
    I said I worked at the best office. Why was it best? First, the boss was a rich man and thought that if he had paid a good wage, the best translators would come to him. Secondly, he was an exception in that, somehow he had learnt that translators needed good dictionaries, not an occassional one or two dictionaries in the office. If , today, he knows that it is not the dictionaries which solve the problem but the background of the translator who is supposed to pick up the right word, he owes this knowledge to me, but my patient to train him was finally over and left that office , too.
    I don't know what is going on in the business now, but if everything has remained the same, forget about that 'specialization' thing. Only very roughly, like medical or engineering type of translations, but don't look for an opportunity where you can translate the laws, regulations, but not balance sheets ( no dictionary in Turkish is available covering all the accounting terms, so this again should be solved by the translator by specialization) or letters of credit terms (don't forget that a very special jargon the banks use for foreign trade, abbreviations have special and important meanings, I was able to translate them right only owing to my bankground in banking business)or land management or insurance policies ( and don't forget: a wrong choice for a word in an insurance policy which is written down on purpose with a sophisticated legal jargon, may put you in serious trouble). If you are not lucky enough, you will do all of them, while at the same time translating a shampoo brochure, this time thinking 'should I use 'vivid' now?and thinking, too ,how you can translate an advertisment with all the serious faced style you have gained in your struggle to become a 'legal text translator'.
    In Turkish there is a saying I love 'he either doesn't know how to count or he has never been beaten up'.
  15. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Ken Grubb in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    Hi Paks, Let me tell you how I started translation , my expectations, the reality and how I finally given up everything and left my career when I was at the best point..
    This real story will give you all the clues you need..
    I studied economics at a university where courses were held in English. I was not interested in the curriculum, which had nothing to do with the real situation in Turkey. But being deeply interested in languages, I decided to improve my English thinking that one day I would study linguistics. I gave up using English-Turkish dictionaries, to begin with, and started using only English-English dicitonaries. To make a long stroy short, I tried other ways to improve my English. Finaly I left the school and decided to try translation. But I was aware that the textbook English was texbook English afterall, I would read Keynes or Karl Marx in English but that was all, this was not real life. Ok, where to start? I started buying and reading some weekly business journals, which, to my great surprise, I was hardly able to understand. A-ha, I said, I can read and understand a discussion between Oscar Lange and Vassily Leontief on political economy, I can even write down my opinion on this dicussion in English, but I CAN'T understand a thing in an article written with real-life English! I didn't give up and gave a new direction to my study. I started to work for an import company, to learn commercial English, commercial communication and similar things. This proved to be the right choice, because, owing to that experience, I started working as a translator for the Ministry of Agriculture. I had no word in my mind in the name of agricultural terminology, but this was not what they needed: The office I worked was carrying out a project with a World Bank credit, so exactly the 'bussiness English' I had made me qualified for the job.
    Years later I was in İstanbul, this time I made some translations for publishers, the topics I translated were varying from architecture to anarchy, Middle Age artists to 'otitis media'. How did they decide that I was qualified to do all that work , a bunch of topics with no common point among themselves? With that question, now we put the first step into the 'what's-wrong-with-translation-business-inTurkey' issue. Actually they were NOT qualified to test my qualification. And this was not an exception: if you intend to work somewhere they will give you a paper to translate, so they will decide if you are qualified or not, for the job. None of the persons to do this will have an objective idea about the quailifications a translator should have. And this will later turn to you as the greatest frustration in your career: As they cannot 'measure' you, there is no limit to what they can ask from you. Actually I worked at the best translation office of Ankara, -some said the best of Turkey- and roundly one third of all the translations I made were too hard for me to handle. Somehow I managed, at the expense of too much time and my nerves. Did anybody estimate what I did? never, except for a few customers who were aware of the difficulty invovled and congratulated me. And a second frustration: the other translator working at the next room to yours, readly and happily does all the work, in as short time as possible, and your boss looks at you with a stupid or empty look in his eyes. How come? which one of us is right now? Is it me who says: nope, this is too much for me, take this text to a translator experienced in that subject, it is not me; or, is it the next room guy who makes everybopdy happy: the customers are happy because their work is finished quickly, the boss is happy obviously and the guy, himself, who never thinks of complaining about how the things going on here. But the difference: One day a customers comes complaining about his work, but he doesn't care because 'the things go on like this'. A third frustration, ok, are the customers complaining about his work right? Really, are the customers right? Let me tell you a true story.
    Years ago the company who built the Atatürk Aiport in İstanbul happened to be the customer of the office I worked (not the 'best one' I mentioned above). I took me more than one year to translate all the agreements and revisions of agreements: sometimes the company was asking the translation of a revision, which sometimes included replacement of a word in English with another one with a slight change in meaning, which was not necessarily available in Turkish.. And I was supposed to reflect all the minor changes on the Turkish verison. If I were not extremely careful on my work I could not reflect those changes in translation. I will not be humble here, it was not something to be managed by anybody who happens to be a translator. But guess what? One day I translated a letter sent by the company to the relevant governemnet office. The terms in the letter should be consistent with the terms which I used in all those official papers. Otherwise the semantic connection would fail. On the other hand, if I were to use the very same terms, the Turkish version would look like a bad translation. Let me give an example for what I mean. The word 'management' is normally translated as 'işletme'. This is an established standard. When 'operation and management' are used together, the right choice for 'operation' is 'işletim', but sometimes the author may prefer to use 'operation' alone,when 'işletim' alone is not clear enough in the Turkish texts, whereas 'işletme' sounds better. This was just an example. Considering many technical points like this, I decided to use exactly the same terms which I used in all the previous texts. Gues what: Mr. somebody stupid from the relevant office called the manager of the company and complained, and didnt forget to add a very brilliant idiom, comparing translation works with beautiful women, who probably always treated him bad. And the manager whom I knew personally and sometimes overworked to make him happy called me telling that he was embarrassed.
    (I will continue)
  16. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Ken Grubb in Translation Specialties with Turkish?   
    Well the person who told me on the phone that he was embarrassed was a veteran American general who hardly could say 'hello' in Turkish. How could I explain the semantic and technical concerns that the work included to him? I was so very annoyed that practically left the job, I didn't translate anymore line for that customer which therefore had to change the office he worked with, and soon I changed my office too. That stupid ignorance that put me so helpless, was and is not an exception in the translation business. language is not like mathematics, where you can prove it, if you are right. But how can I prove that I make the right choice depending only on my accumulated knowledge or experinece? No way. For any reason whatsoever the boss, the customer or even any other translator involved may choose the party who can say the right word or the final word on the issue. In the American general case, the customer-government office was supposed to be right, probably because the office was the customer of the American company and a government office . What the hell I was doing at my office calling myself a translator, then? The poor guy who was frustrated by women as a rule, had no idea about the difference between a semantic translation and fluent translation, otherwise he would only keep quiet.
    Another example: before accepting the job, I told the boss of a translation office that I wouldn't make any translation simply because I was asked to do so. I was badly needed there, so the boss had to accept my prerequest. One day a text to be translated was sent by the Ministry of Culture about the life of an Anatolian saint. Considering the importance of the customer, I was asked to do it. No, I said, give it to somebody who have some experience in that. As we agreed before, she accepted. Indeed, a few days later a very good, professionaly translated text was in my hand. I read it carefully, and told the boss that she can send it to the customer, confidently. Alas! Miss Secretary of Mr. somebody at the ministry hapenned to know this business better than me: One day the boss told me that the 'customer' was on the phone. 'Ok, what's wrong?' I asked. ' Miss secretary had noticed that somewhere in the text the letter 'n' somewhow was typed as 'r', which I missed. Miss Secretary told me very self confidently that 'Although I DON'T KNOW English, I noticed this this mistake, God knows how many other major mistakes must be in the text!' Reasoning? did you say reasoning? Forget it. In translation business reasoning is luxury.
    I can make this list long. The final is not a happy end. I struggled for my rights for years, I attempted to discuss with other translators, tried to convince them that we shouldn't be left so unreasonably alone. We should insist on our right for specialization, etc..
    To my great surprise, only one or two nodded , and only nodded .
    I said I worked at the best office. Why was it best? First, the boss was a rich man and thought that if he had paid a good wage, the best translators would come to him. Secondly, he was an exception in that, somehow he had learnt that translators needed good dictionaries, not an occassional one or two dictionaries in the office. If , today, he knows that it is not the dictionaries which solve the problem but the background of the translator who is supposed to pick up the right word, he owes this knowledge to me, but my patient to train him was finally over and left that office , too.
    I don't know what is going on in the business now, but if everything has remained the same, forget about that 'specialization' thing. Only very roughly, like medical or engineering type of translations, but don't look for an opportunity where you can translate the laws, regulations, but not balance sheets ( no dictionary in Turkish is available covering all the accounting terms, so this again should be solved by the translator by specialization) or letters of credit terms (don't forget that a very special jargon the banks use for foreign trade, abbreviations have special and important meanings, I was able to translate them right only owing to my bankground in banking business)or land management or insurance policies ( and don't forget: a wrong choice for a word in an insurance policy which is written down on purpose with a sophisticated legal jargon, may put you in serious trouble). If you are not lucky enough, you will do all of them, while at the same time translating a shampoo brochure, this time thinking 'should I use 'vivid' now?and thinking, too ,how you can translate an advertisment with all the serious faced style you have gained in your struggle to become a 'legal text translator'.
    In Turkish there is a saying I love 'he either doesn't know how to count or he has never been beaten up'.
  17. Like
    saffron got a reaction from mrs in Getting Familiar With Turkish Sounds   
    I think one of the most problematic sounds of Turkish for a learner is 'ı'. In fact it is not so unfamiliar as it looks. If you examine the following examples, I hope, you can pronounce it as a Turkish speaking person does..
    Actually this 'ı' is the sound between 'd' and 'l' in handle or candle..
    If you try to say them slowly, the 'ı' between 'd' and 'l' can be heard..
    If I would write these words as I hear in the way my ears are accustomed to hear the Turkish words, I would write them as 'kendıl' and hendıl'. As the sound between Turkish 'a' and Turkish 'e' can most of the time be said as 'e' in Turkish, I wrote them as kendıl and hendıl. In other words, there is no letter corresponding to the English 'a' in handle or many other similar words. As to the sound itself, in some words of Arabic or Persian origin a sound similar to the English 'a' in handle can be heard, but only similar, not the same (example: 'lazım'= necessary)Turning back to 'ı', there is another way that you can try..'Tender' let's say...the 'r' at the end is only slightly heard. If you remove it, you will have 'tendı'. Or try 'chapter'. Just focus on the 'er' and try not to hear 'r'. What you will get is the Turkish 'ı'.
  18. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Vic801 in Freaking Out   
    Hi Paks..
    When I was a child, I had many chances to observe communications between local people and tourists, which had no chance to say or understand a couple of Turkish words or phrases in Cappadocia, one of the oldest tourizm zones in Turkey. In those years English courses were not as commmon as today, and the tourists guides were not readily available. With no Turkish, on the one hand, and with a highschool English -the best chance- on the other, people were having good times together with no apparent communication problem. I remember that I envied their joy,and laughter when my brothers invited a group of tourists for a dinner or something like that. The picture I am trying to draw is, communication is a magical thing, people understand each other somehow, no intend to criticize the other one comes to minds, both of the parties feel happy when they solve some part of the puzzle brought by language barrier, I observed this many times, not only in early years of my life, but on many occassions up today. I don't know how the people of other cultures feel in similar conditions but Turks normally don't expect to hear Turkish words, let alone phrases, from foreigners. When they hear they just like it, and never ever think about laughing at a wrong word: What can be more normal than a wrong word to be heard from non native speaker? Paks, they simply love it, try to speak Turkish if you like, but don't worry, the worst result will be a broad smile of reward for your attempt.
    I don't think that memorizing phrases is a good idea. This will create an impression that you know Turkish more than you do. Normally you are not expected to memorize Turkish phrases. if you say 'havaalanına nasıl giderim?' they will think you'll understand the reply as well.
    I wonder what is written in those 'guide' books. Turks normally don't criticize people of different cultural origin for failing to observe their 'rules'. The Ottoman Empire was a patchwork of many cultures, they learnt very long ago that the world was not all the same.
    Probably those books try to be interesting, by writing interesting things. Further, depending on the region and education level, some of the advices given make some sense, and some don't. My sincere advice is forget them all!
  19. Like
    saffron got a reaction from conan198903 in Freaking Out   
    Hi Paks..
    When I was a child, I had many chances to observe communications between local people and tourists, which had no chance to say or understand a couple of Turkish words or phrases in Cappadocia, one of the oldest tourizm zones in Turkey. In those years English courses were not as commmon as today, and the tourists guides were not readily available. With no Turkish, on the one hand, and with a highschool English -the best chance- on the other, people were having good times together with no apparent communication problem. I remember that I envied their joy,and laughter when my brothers invited a group of tourists for a dinner or something like that. The picture I am trying to draw is, communication is a magical thing, people understand each other somehow, no intend to criticize the other one comes to minds, both of the parties feel happy when they solve some part of the puzzle brought by language barrier, I observed this many times, not only in early years of my life, but on many occassions up today. I don't know how the people of other cultures feel in similar conditions but Turks normally don't expect to hear Turkish words, let alone phrases, from foreigners. When they hear they just like it, and never ever think about laughing at a wrong word: What can be more normal than a wrong word to be heard from non native speaker? Paks, they simply love it, try to speak Turkish if you like, but don't worry, the worst result will be a broad smile of reward for your attempt.
    I don't think that memorizing phrases is a good idea. This will create an impression that you know Turkish more than you do. Normally you are not expected to memorize Turkish phrases. if you say 'havaalanına nasıl giderim?' they will think you'll understand the reply as well.
    I wonder what is written in those 'guide' books. Turks normally don't criticize people of different cultural origin for failing to observe their 'rules'. The Ottoman Empire was a patchwork of many cultures, they learnt very long ago that the world was not all the same.
    Probably those books try to be interesting, by writing interesting things. Further, depending on the region and education level, some of the advices given make some sense, and some don't. My sincere advice is forget them all!
  20. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Abi in Freaking Out   
    Hi Paks..
    When I was a child, I had many chances to observe communications between local people and tourists, which had no chance to say or understand a couple of Turkish words or phrases in Cappadocia, one of the oldest tourizm zones in Turkey. In those years English courses were not as commmon as today, and the tourists guides were not readily available. With no Turkish, on the one hand, and with a highschool English -the best chance- on the other, people were having good times together with no apparent communication problem. I remember that I envied their joy,and laughter when my brothers invited a group of tourists for a dinner or something like that. The picture I am trying to draw is, communication is a magical thing, people understand each other somehow, no intend to criticize the other one comes to minds, both of the parties feel happy when they solve some part of the puzzle brought by language barrier, I observed this many times, not only in early years of my life, but on many occassions up today. I don't know how the people of other cultures feel in similar conditions but Turks normally don't expect to hear Turkish words, let alone phrases, from foreigners. When they hear they just like it, and never ever think about laughing at a wrong word: What can be more normal than a wrong word to be heard from non native speaker? Paks, they simply love it, try to speak Turkish if you like, but don't worry, the worst result will be a broad smile of reward for your attempt.
    I don't think that memorizing phrases is a good idea. This will create an impression that you know Turkish more than you do. Normally you are not expected to memorize Turkish phrases. if you say 'havaalanına nasıl giderim?' they will think you'll understand the reply as well.
    I wonder what is written in those 'guide' books. Turks normally don't criticize people of different cultural origin for failing to observe their 'rules'. The Ottoman Empire was a patchwork of many cultures, they learnt very long ago that the world was not all the same.
    Probably those books try to be interesting, by writing interesting things. Further, depending on the region and education level, some of the advices given make some sense, and some don't. My sincere advice is forget them all!
  21. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Abi in Verbal agreement to sell a property in turkey   
    Hi Rocamber, I'm sorry to hear that problem. I want to try to clarify the issue on the grounds: 1- power of attorney 2- any other effective document like a contract.
    If you have given a power of attorney to him, that document will bind you. However you have the right to cancell it any time, if you have not cancelled yet, hurry up. Your story sounds a bit complex, so I cannot tell exactly what power you have given to him.
    As to a contract, obviously a contract binds the parties. But there are ways to refuse to fufill the obligations brought by the contract. If a contract is signed under such circumstances as a threat, or other action forcing one of the parties to do something, you can file a petition to that effect. If you can prove that the other party caused you to sign the contract , under abnormal conditions like a threat, the contract will not be effective legaly. There is another way to refuse to fullfill the contract terms: Is the contract in question a legally effective contract? By this I mean, a conract should be legally acceptable, otherwise it cannot be called a contract legally. The contract terms should be consistent with laws. A contract is considered as an evidence for a deal between the parties, from which both of the parties are assumed to get some benefit . Let me give an absurd example to explain what I mean: You cannot make a 'sale' contract with someone by which you sell your property for nothing in return. If you sign something like that the judge will think you are forced to do so.
    Your case maybe handled considering these features of a contract. Probably a lawyer can help you by bringing enough evidence to cancell the thing that the other party calls ' a contract' .
  22. Like
    saffron got a reaction from conan198903 in Single Men Unwanted In Turkey?   
    If the neighbourhood is chosen properly, no problem of this kind will occur. Then the problem is how to know the proper district, quarter, apartment building and the owner of the flat.
    On the other hand, if the wrong place is chosen once, then it is impossible to fight. Would they tolerate a foreigner? might be. But if they don't , and if they use the power they have, namely agreement among themselves which would create a rigid social pressure, filing a petition against the unwanted tenant, then the foreign tenant has only one way to follow: going straight to the nearest lawyer that he could rely on, but even then this may fail: you cannot fight against the majority all alone.
    If the building is occupied by reasonable people but landlord is a trouble maker, the situation can be handled more easily. Turkish laws secure the rights of tenants in many ways.
  23. Like
    saffron got a reaction from conan198903 in Single Men Unwanted In Turkey?   
    Hi Conan, as a Turkish member I feel I can write a few words that can make the situation better for you..
    First of all, being single is an anthropological issue, I assume..
    Because in primates -I dont remember exactly which species of primates- a male primate has to prove that 'he' is reliable to hold a baby in his arms.
    When he holds the baby, as allowed by the female primate, then other males prefer not to touch him, they let him alone..
    A security isssue, this is. Interestingly enough, in human societies, a male with children recieve more protection from the society. I cannot make a list of 'socities', and I'm not an anthropologist, but there is such a trend, in general.
    As to Turkey, what I wrote is exctly true. A married man with children recieve protection; for instance, if one of two employees has to leave the job because of the budgetary policy of a company, and if one of them is single, it is almost sure that the single one will loose his job. Because the other 'has children'. I can make a list of situations like that.
    But, in your case, we should take into account another aspect: When a single man moves to the nextdoor of a 'family', he is considered as a potential danger for the female members of the family. Will he bother them? This is a very serious issue. If that single neighbour attempts to bother any female member of the family, the issue will not be settled by a simple 'get out of here'. Instead, a quarrel first, an attempt to beat the offender, or even more serious things afterwords. So no body wants to bother himself with a 'potential problem' around. Shortly, Conan, a single man living nextdoor is a potential headache..
    But the rest of story is not so bad. Turkish people are interesting and it is not easy to know them in a short time. If that single neighbour proves that he is a gentleman, and in particular if he is young enough,it is almost sure that he will be treated very dearly: Oh the poor single boy! let's call him for diner! Does he need any thing? etc etc..
    So please don't worry. If your neighbour doesn't have personal problems, I mean if s/he is not a trouble maker, soon you will be treated dearly 'Oh that boy! he is far from his country! He is Chinese? He even doesn't know the language here! Can he eat what we eat? Let's help him..' You can expect somebody knocking on your door with a cup of soup in her hand.
    The only thing you have to pay attention is, if you want a peaceful life there, don't let girls visit you, this will annoy them, they will say ' we cannot tell how many people, boy or girl, come and go!' Even if they happen to see two or three occassional visitors, they will start complaing : ' so many people come and go'. Don't ask me why, these are the clues for a life free of trouble!
  24. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Abi in Guide For Foreign Students   
    Today I recieved a message from a member who wants to study in METU and says she cannot find a useful link or information in the forum. Actualy I had an assumption that this subforum included a link to the relevant page of 'ÖSYM'-The Board of Higher Education. I couldn't see any, though I didn't check carefully. Anyway, even if there is link already , the title of my post will draw attention and would help somebody.
    I cannot copy and paste anything here, probably I have to know something needed to copy and paste a text or link. So, instead of a link, I will write the key words: If you write 'guide for foreign students' , on the search engine, the site to appear under the words' Türkiye'deki yükseköğretim programları için yurtdışından kabul-ÖSYM' will lead you to the guide in both English and Turkish. The list of the universities accepting students of foreign nationality, as well as acceptance conditions are in the guide.
    These guides are updated, so you need to be sure that the guide you read is effective for the year that you plan to study. For Turkish students , a new version of the guide is released annualy, but I don't know what is the case for foreign students.
  25. Like
    saffron got a reaction from Sunny in Excellent Turkish-Learning Websites   
    Hi folks! I hope you are doing well!
    Sometimes I drop in and take a look around..
    Let me add a note about this idiom: Turkish people use this idiom in particular in a criticizing way: Not when two nice features match, but when the features subject to criticism are concerned. If you say , let's say, to a newly married couple 'tencere yuvarlanmış, kapağını bulmuş' this will directly humiliate the couple!
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