10 replies to this topic

[Vic801]

This is probably not the right section in which to post it. Mods, feel free to move it somewhere more appropriate.

A lot of people in Turkey complain about all the paperwork and bureaucracy but if you've ever lived in France you would understand that here is bliss.
Resident permits are now not necessary for EU nationals in France but up until 2005 they were. You got only a 1 year permit which could be renewed 1 year and then a 5 year one until be able to apply for a 10 year one. After queuing for hours (you take your ticket at 9 am and you get to the desk at 4 pm) they give you a list of all the documents to produce. These are never the same ones. I met 2 people from my home town as I left the "Cité des Etrangers" in Bordeaux and we compared lists; all 3 were different. For example they had to produce the result of a full medical check and I didn't, I had to give a bank statement showing sufficiant funds in my account and they didn't etc.
The stupidity and rudeness of the people who worked there apalled me (and I went through the same thing in Bordeaux, Marseille, Nice and Nantes). You had to put up with racist comments and silly employees who used slang or patois words to throw you off course and then laugh at you because you didn't understand.
And when you lost another day queuing up to bring your documents you just got a little pink piece of paper to keep in your passport and come back in 3 months to get your little plastic card. Of course in 3 months it is not ready so they renew your pink piece of paper and you back 3 months later. It took me 9 months to get my first residence permit (of course which expired in 3 months).

So when we go to the Emniyet, are treated respectfully, are offered tea and cakes and pick up the little blue book in the afternoon of the same day, well I think the system works well.
Doesn't stop me laughing when we have to go to the notary and see that out of the 4 employees, one is obviously only employed to take the staples out of the documents, one does the photocopies, the other one re-staples and the last one puts at least 10 stamps on each page (if every we start up another company, I am sure rubber stamps would be a great idea).
But honestly every time we have had dealings with administration and banks in Turkey the employees have been polite and helpful and seem to take pleasure in beating the system (You don't have a yabanci kimlik number, don't worry, I know a way to get around that.) Even if nobody queues up properly and everybody pokes their nose in your business, things Get Done. The guy behind the desk can handle three requests at once, answer the telephone, order his tea, swivel his whirlygig with the rubber stamps and stamp happily all over the place. Turkey is the first place I have seen multi-tasking men!

[sunny]

Another great thumbnail of life.

This is worth remembering when as you trudge up the stairs to get another (useless) stamp on your bits of paper.

Actually, getting a residence permit here is a lot easier now than it used to be and the staff are much more friendly and helpful, believe me.

[Mimar]

Thanks Vic ! I agree ! Though I can't speak for the situation in İstanbul where I'm sure it's a bit more hectic, I can speak for Ankara (which is still a fairly large city with a lot of foreign residents and students). I have to say that my experience here has been overwhelmingly positive. Sure things take time and you have to go up and down a lot of stairs, but I've found that if you are polite and smile and are patient vs. huffy and puffy at the least delay, that the public employees that you deal with are generally more than willing to be of help and have a "hey we're all human" point of view (!!).

I too went through the machinery in Europe (Germany) which although there were a few exceptions, was one of the most exasperating and degrading experiences I've ever had and that over years and years. Still makes me shudder and I'm not the kind of person who gets worked up over things like that lightly. Turkish Bureaucracy ? I'd prefer it to what I experienced in Europe any day.

[Reyhan]

I should find out about those same procedures in the US for residency permits. I mean the Dept of State website can list all the required procedures but I don't know how the actual physical experience is for people trying to get a permit to live, work or marry in the US. My exposure to the US bureaucracy has probably only been limited to certain procedures in the US Division of Motor Vehicles, which I had thought were annoying mostly though necessary. So true compared to some EU countries, Im sure experiences in Turkey would seem like a gentle breeze

[scobbiebhoy]

Doesn't stop me laughing when we have to go to the notary and see that out of the 4 employees, one is obviously only employed to take the staples out of the documents, one does the photocopies, the other one re-staples and the last one puts at least 10 stamps on each page (if every we start up another company, I am sure rubber stamps would be a great idea).


Ah the Henry Ford, assembly line model......taken a little bit too far. Seen all over Turkey. However to be fair, i work in North Africa and job creation for the sake of job creation is 100 times worse here!

[sunny]

Rubber stamp manufacturer or a photographer are both secure jobs in T.

[dande]

A lot of people in Turkey complain about all the paperwork and bureaucracy but if you've ever lived in France you would understand that here is bliss.

About 10 years ago we purchased our first (second hand) car here in Çeṣme. As a first-time buyer I was bewildered by all the paperwork, rubber stamps, visits to Notor, etc. You all know the sort of thing. Then I read about the bureaucracy involved in such a transaction in France (possibly a Peter Mayle novel) and realised how comparatively easy it had been here. Thanks for reminding me!

[Vic801]

What amaezd me in France was the Stupidity of it. You can't get the pink paper if you don't have the green one. But in order to get the green one you need the pink one!

For example, for my first residency permit I needed proof of residence. I was living in a government-run hostel at that time. The director told me that he couldn't give a document as proof of residence until I had my residence permit. But as an intelligent man he told me that the paper was on his desk and that he was going to the toilet. So I understood and took the documnet, filled it in and signed it myself.

Other stupid things in France was being threatened with a heavy fine for not having indicated my change of address when I was calling the police to tell them that there was a burgarly happening!

[samanthaozkara]

Aww I dont have a lot of patients and I get very annoyed at times here in Izmir but if I was in France I would have needed a residence permit to do a sentence in a french prison for murder haha!!


I have got to say the workers here in Turkey are very very friendly and polite and do the best they can. The amount of times I have gone to the Emniyet, they tend to remember me and also my husbands old school friend is a worker in the office but is not allowed to handle my paperwork. Vic801, how come you get your ikamet on the same day! I have to wait a week for mine!! But we do tell them we are travelling from Özdere and they do try and get it done within 2-3 days which cheeses me off as it shows they can do it in that time space, it could probably be done by the time you finish running up and down the stairs for these stamps haha.

xxx

[Vic801]

Vic801, how come you get your ikamet on the same day! I have to wait a week for mine!! xxx

Just must be my sweet smile!!

[samanthaozkara]

Well I am not impressed by that!! I must renew mine on Monday so I will give them a sweet smile too and if it dont work I will complain haha xxx